hunters_forest | Coldfire re-read: Black Sun Rising

carmentalis.livejournal.com posting in

Plot Summary
Chapter 19
Our travelers reach the somewhat seedy city of Kale, a port town if ever there was one. To re-orient themselves and figure out whether Ciani's assailants are present, Senzei Divines their situation and almost gets sucked into the dark fae vortex of the Forest. Damien patches him up and gets him settled, then heads out to find them transport for the next leg of their journey. He encounters difficulties in the form of a ship captain who can't be hired and not even be bribed to take them. Assistance arrives in the form of Gerald Tarrant, whose presence is enough to make the captain reconsider. Tarrant and Damien have yet another almost-argument, which does little to put Damien's misgivings about him to rest. After performing the Divining for the demons' presence for Damien, Tarrant is invited to join them on their hunt. It's only afterwards that Damien finds out that Tarrant is connected to the Forest.

Chapter 20
Our new mystery traveler arrives in Morgot, and takes care of the loose end that is her ship's captain by letting him meet an accident with the xandu he was promised as payment.

Quotes

Evil is what you make of it, the Prophet had written. Bind it to a higher Purpose, and you will have altered its nature. And: We use what tools we must.
Damien wondered if - and how - Gerald Tarrant could be bound.

And one thing is as certain as the night sky above him, the broad disk of Domina looming overhead: he alone can channel this power, can make it serve their purpose. Who else? Certainly not Ciani, whose skill was excised from her. Nor Damien, whose priestly Workings are too entangled with intellect, with questions of morality and correctness and Revivalist philosophy . . . no, of all of them only he can master this terrible force and make it serve their will.

Tarrant’s expression tightened, ever so slightly. The pale eyes narrowed. “Am I what?”
“Human.”
“Ah. Let’s not get into philosophy, shall we? Say that I was born a man - as you were - and as for what a man may become . . . we don’t all follow paths that our mothers would have approved of, do we?”

He met Tarrant’s eyes - so pale, so cold - and suddenly understood what made the man so dangerous. Control. Over himself, over his environment . . . and over everyone who dealt with him.

One corner of Tarrant’s mouth twitched slightly; a smile? “We do serve the same cause,” he observed. “If you won’t trust me, trust in that.”
“Should I trust you?”
“I would say . . .” He smiled, and shook his head. “No. Not you.”

Thoughts

Whenever quotes from the Prophet come up, it's intriguing to see their reflection in Gerald and in Damien. We use what tools we must. It's a guiding principle for both of them - pragmatism over principle.

We get another look at Senzei's inner motivations here, and I have to admit that it makes me like him less. He gets lost more and more in his need to control the fae, and here it is paired with a need to know that while he can do all he wants, he also can do it better than his companions.

Do you think that Gerald might have had something to do with shifting the Stekkis river and turning Merentha from a river port to an inland town?

Considering Gerald's disinclination to lie, it is interesting to see him admit that he underestimated Damien in their little power play over the boy in Briand. Do you think Damien actually managed to pull off his little bluff?

Their second encounter, and the second time that Damien overcomes his initial adverse reaction to Tarrant, lets him assist, and afterwards regrets it when he learns something new. It's becoming a pattern for them.

How much outside contact does the Forest maintain? In Jaggonath, it was only about the general threat of the Hunter and the demons originating from the fae concentration. Here in Kale, they seem to have a much better idea what they're dealing with and they're resigned to it. Am I the only one who is strongly reminded of Dracula here?

On Monday it's chapter 21 for a merry boat trip to Morgot. As always, enjoy yourselves in the discussion!

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

From:

prettyarbitrary.livejournal.com

I can forgive Senzei his desire to do something better than his companions. I don't think it stems from greed, necessarily, so much as a desire to prove he's useful in their group--and if everybody else can do everything better than he can, then how much do they need him? The answer is quite a bit, actually, but I get the impression of Senzei being one of those quiet people who never made much of a visible impact in their lives, and who might wonder if he's got any real purpose at all. This comes up again during the crossing of the Canopy, when he finds that he's valuable to the group in small skills that never struck him as anything but pathetic before--and it seems to help him find some confidence in himself then.

There's also his fae addiction, of course. It's not necessarily wise for him to tempt himself like this ("the occasion to sin" as Catholics would say).

But what strikes me in that particular quote is Damien's sorcery being "tied up in intellect." I've been peering deeply into these texts, trying to figure out what the nuances of the different philosophies might be for pagan sorcerers as opposed to Church ones, and this makes me wonder: if that's how he sees the priest's philosophy, then what's his own like?

“Should I trust you?”
“I would say . . .” He smiled, and shook his head. “No. Not you.”

I love that exchange! There's something so loaded about it. You can tell already that Tarrant's not referring to whether he'll stab Damien in the back when he turns around.

I've wondered about the Forest's contact with the outside world, myself. Apparently they make kick-ass beer...and I almost get the sense that there's a certain patronage of surrounding rural communities. There is something rather reminiscent of Dracula there. They fear the place, but it also provides their livelihood...so long as they stay within certain bounds.

From:

carmentalis.livejournal.com

What bugs me about Senzei is the point you raise about his addiction. It's such a contrast to Ciani, Damien and Gerald - to them it is a tool to be used, or in Ciani's case, a sense to be regained. But for Senzei it is a craving that is beyond healthy, and the need for purpose takes second place behind it. It makes me wonder where he'd draw the line when it comes to sacrificing something if it meant more fae control for him.

I've been peering deeply into these texts, trying to figure out what the nuances of the different philosophies might be for pagan sorcerers as opposed to Church ones, and this makes me wonder: if that's how he sees the priest's philosophy, then what's his own like?

Fewer limitations, I suspect. Damien's limit is using the fae not for his own purposes, but to support his mission. I don't think we ever see him Work for his own comfort, or even that of others. He'll Heal when necessary, and otherwise Work when it is needed to gain them an advantage in some way. But he'd never Work to clean his clothes like Tarrant, or use it for commercial purposes like Ciani. There are a few moments when he Sees out of curiosity, but even those are debatable.

I love that exchange! There's something so loaded about it. You can tell already that Tarrant's not referring to whether he'll stab Damien in the back when he turns around.

Their whole discussion is such a central portrait of what they're like. Distrustful, pragmatic to the core, eager to out-maneuver each other, but finally accepting cooperation. And so many layers. It's something that's hard to appreciate on a first read.

They fear the place, but it also provides their livelihood...so long as they stay within certain bounds.

It's a mixture of liege system and protection racket. Behave yourselves and you will not come to harm, but there is a tithe in place to ensure your wellbeing. Misbehaviour, and you might just end up like the inhabitants of some villages who tried to revolt. But behave and there will be proper rewards. Gerald's feudalism roots might be coming to the fore here.

From:

trobadora

If they make good beer, they can't be all bad. :D

Still, I wonder how it all works. What do Gerald's people do all day? How do they interact with normal people? What's happening in Jahanna? Who's actually brewing the beer, and running the brewery?

Yes, those are important questions! Never underestimate the importance of beer. :D

From:

prettyarbitrary.livejournal.com

I know! Does he have monstrous maggot-people toiling over piles of hops in there? Or does "the Forest" just mean the people who live near the Forest?

From:

trobadora

*giggles*

I've seriously been wondering about that for quite a while. Somehow I can't see Amoril as a brewer ...

From:

carmentalis.livejournal.com

I have trouble picturing Gerald as a brewer, too. Unless he had ulterior motives. Like dominating the surrounding towns by turning the Forest into the only source of good beer on the continent. That would be quite a safeguard against attacks!